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      usairman737


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      Post #68275, posted on 09-27-2017 GMT-5 hours    
      Any suggestions on improving the subject plastic kit? I don't expect to make it into an AA resin beauty, just make it look better. Too many great decals to go to waste without a cheaper alternative on which to apply them.

      Gerry

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      TheFlyingDutchman


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      Post #68277, posted on 09-27-2017 GMT-5 hours    
      I've seen people build beautiful models of the Revell kit. It's a lot of work but that's the fun part, isn't it?
      I can't give you any drawings or dimensions, but this is what I know:

      -the roof above the windscreen needs to be higher, fixing this with putty will greatly improve the overall sight of the model
      -the fuselage should be thicker at the front part, when seen from top-down
      -the engines are better off being replaced by aftermarket ones
      -the wings are too thick, especially at the trailing edges

      I'm sure lots of people can give you more details on how to fix the Revell 747!

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      FokkerFan


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      Post #68282, posted on 09-27-2017 GMT-5 hours    
      I also read that the wing root is wrong and that the canoes that house the mechanics for the flaps start too far forward under the wing. I beloven this only applies to the two canoes closest to the fuselage under each wing, so 4 in total. Regarding the engines I believe they are OK for GE CF6-80's with the exception that the exhaust cones go from wide to narrow in a straight line, where it should be a more wavy line or coke-bottle shape if you will.

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      B747FAN


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      Post #68284, posted on 09-27-2017 GMT-5 hours    
      Greatest issue for me was the nose section. So i cut it from a Revell 747-200 and now it looks very well.

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      Stevej


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      Post #68289, posted on 09-28-2017 GMT-5 hours    
      I rebuilt one that I had built when the model was first released and I currently have a new one on the bench. During the rebuild I did just about every thing mentioned above and a lot of reshaping the nose and cockpit areas. Added height above the windshield. Broke open the fuselage and doubled walled the entire nose section so I could reshape it. The problem with the wing attachment is that the trailing edge is approx 1/8 inch too high up where it meets the fuselage. The result is when the gear is attached the model sits way too low, the engines almost touching the ground. IIRC there was a thread here somewhere that demonstrated how to correct the wing attachment and it is major surgery best to avoided unless you can't sleep with it at night. What I did was glued 1/8 inch tiny blocks in the wheel wells, drilled new holes and installed the gear. The model sits correctly on the gear and the wing problem is barely noticeable. See below

      http://www.airlinercafe.com/photo_19792.details.large

      The new kit I am working on is the Iron Maiden release that is going to be British Airways. This Revell mold is just about ready for retirement. Lots of flash and distorted parts, the APU exhaust was only half there and warping is a problem. The engines are from Bra-Z. Some mentioned here a while ago that Revell had reworked the mold to correct the problems but I don't see it on this kit.

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      LH707


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      Post #68291, posted on 09-28-2017 GMT-5 hours    
      Quote
      FokkerFan :
      I also read that the wing root is wrong and that the canoes that house the mechanics for the flaps start too far forward under the wing. I beloven this only applies to the two canoes closest to the fuselage under each wing, so 4 in total. Regarding the engines I believe they are OK for GE CF6-80's with the exception that the exhaust cones go from wide to narrow in a straight line, where it should be a more wavy line or coke-bottle shape if you will.


      The CF6 is the cone shaped one, it's the PW4056 that has the coke bottle core.

      To add to these, the winglets are a bit off as well, you'll see it when you look at it.

      I guess you have to ask yourself the question "how many bugs can I live with?" Next, figure out how much rework you're willing to do, and plan accordingly. If you're looking to save cost relative to an AA 744, you might be better off getting a Revell 748 and a set of resin engines. Then you just fill the extra rudder hinge line, scribe an extra flap segment, scratch the winglets, and chop out two tube segments. Probably less work than fixing the 744 kit.

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      Jennings


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      Post #68292, posted on 09-28-2017 GMT-5 hours    
      And.... the wing roots are in the wrong place, and the airfoil profile is far too skinny.

      The kit is a mess from nose to tail.

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      usairman737


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      Post #68295, posted on 09-28-2017 GMT-5 hours    
      Jennings,

      Do you have one of those "cut here" drawings for converting a Revell -748 to a -400? Share, please if you do. This has probably been discussed previously, but my vision was pretty bad there for awhile,

      Gerry

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      Post #68296, posted on 09-28-2017 GMT-5 hours    
      8 frames forward (behind the upper deck door).

      3 frames aft (between the L3 and L4 doors - good luck on that!



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      usairman737


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      Post #68306, posted on 09-29-2017 GMT-5 hours    
      Steve wrote, "there was a thread here somewhere that demonstrated how to correct the wing attachment". Does anyone know where this is? Share, please, as at my age I need something to keep me awake!

      Gerry

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      Post #68307, posted on 09-29-2017 GMT-5 hours    
      Gerry,

      Here's the wing attachment fix:



      And here's a clearer drawing from Jennings:


      Scott Garard
      YSCB/CBR

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      LH707


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      Post #68309, posted on 09-30-2017 GMT-5 hours    
      Ok, I stand by my earlier recommendation. Better to saw two donuts out than to do all that wing root fixing.

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      usairman737


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      Post #68313, posted on 09-30-2017 GMT-5 hours    
      Lots of opinions on the fuselage of a cut-down -8, but what about the rest of the airframe? Especially the "new" -8 wing and the (aftermarket?) engines and their pylons? Are the Revell -400 parts usable for the latter?

      Gerry

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      Post #68314, posted on 09-30-2017 GMT-5 hours    
      Thanks. I couldn’t find that illustration!

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      Post #68316, posted on 09-30-2017 GMT-5 hours    
      Quote
      usairman737 :
      Lots of opinions on the fuselage of a cut-down -8, but what about the rest of the airframe? Especially the "new" -8 wing and the (aftermarket?) engines and their pylons? Are the Revell -400 parts usable for the latter?



      Gerry, for some reason this post has me thinking about getting my hands on a Revell -400 to see if there's not a way it can be brought up to snuff with a little less fuss. I'm already thinking about an alternate method for fixing the wing angle, for instance, and if I can find a Revell -400 cheap at next weekend's airliner show at the Delta Museum I may buy one and do some experimenting.

      I know a cut-down Zvezda kit could be turned into a really nice -400, and while there are several parts from the Revell kit that would be useful in a kitbash project with the Zvezda kit, it makes me ache a little to think of substantial parts of two kits ending up in a dumpster. Buying two kits to use only about half of each could get pricey, too, which might run afoul of the desire to stay cost-effective.

      If things work out and I end up with a -400 kit I can use as a testbed, I'll share my results. I know it's not a great kit, but having once been the fat kid on the playground that people made fun of, my heart kind of goes out to it a little.

      Jodie Peeler

      In 1924 Wien was Alaska's first airline. In 1980 it still is.

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      Holmes757


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      Post #68318, posted on 10-01-2017 GMT-5 hours    
      Jodie Peeler

      You can always sell the unused parts... always have somebody looking to buy extra parts!!

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      Post #68321, posted on 10-01-2017 GMT-5 hours    
      Aside from the wing tip and the different flap configuration, the -8 wing is the same shape as the earlier wing. The airfoil is different, but nobody is going to notice that on a model.

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      Post #68322, posted on 10-01-2017 GMT-5 hours    
      Yeah, the flap canoes are also a bit different.

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      Post #68325, posted on 10-01-2017 GMT-5 hours    
      Well, the Colorado Rockies are in the US baseball playoffs, so maybe the Revell -400 kit has a chance to be a "winner".

      I'll cheat and use a 747-200/300 Revell kit nose, as I'm terrible at making noses look better.

      Gerry

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      Post #68328, posted on 10-02-2017 GMT-5 hours    
      I would like to attempt the -800 slice and dice. Seems to be the easier out. How well the -400 wings mate with the -800 fuselage could be another matter. Rather not be just kicking the can down the road.

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      Post #68941, posted on 12-31-2017 GMT-5 hours    
      Best I could do. The flap fairings on the 748 were noticeably different so I cut the fairings from the 744 wing and glued onto the 748 wing filled with putty. The nose looks a little squashed in the photos and that is just lens distortion, the model looks like a 744 should look, glad I made the effort.


      1528-744 (2).jpg 1528-744 (3).jpg 1528-744 (4).jpg 1528-744 (5).jpg 1528-744 (6).jpg 1528-744 (1).jpg

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      Post #68942, posted on 01-01-2018 GMT-5 hours    
      Quote
      Stevej :
      I would like to attempt the -800 slice and dice. Seems to be the easier out. How well the -400 wings mate with the -800 fuselage could be another matter. Rather not be just kicking the can down the road.



      The wings are one of the worst parts of the -400 kit. You'll get a better result by simply converting the -8 wing to a -400 wing.

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      Post #68943, posted on 01-01-2018 GMT-5 hours    
      Quote
      Jennings :
      Quote
      Stevej :
      I would like to attempt the -800 slice and dice. Seems to be the easier out. How well the -400 wings mate with the -800 fuselage could be another matter. Rather not be just kicking the can down the road.



      The wings are one of the worst parts of the -400 kit. You'll get a better result by simply converting the -8 wing to a -400 wing.



      I agree, that's what I am doing. Click on the linK.

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      Post #68949, posted on 01-02-2018 GMT-5 hours    
      Has anyone looked at the Dragon 747-4 ? I bought one a couple of years back at the UK IPMS Nationals very cheap, a cursory inspection leads me to think that it is a direct scale up of the 1/200 Hesagawa kit , but as for accuracy I dont know,but would this be a better starting point ? instead of all the correction work on the Revell kit.
      Any comment from anyone who has built this kit, would be useful.

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      Post #68953, posted on 01-03-2018 GMT-5 hours    
      It has nothing in any way to do with the (now almost 40-year old!!!) Hasegawa 1/200 kit. It's pretty bad.

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      Post #68955, posted on 01-03-2018 GMT-5 hours    
      I looked at the Dragon kit when first released, although it's not anywhere near as bad as the Nitto/Doyusa/Kepuyuan garbage, going up the list that would be Number 1 worst, followed by Airfix, then Dragon.

      I was stunned when Revell announce a thing like the An225, yet won't redo what could be a really big seller like the a B747-400, obviously making money is not a priority, yet I thought these kit manufacturers were supposed to be run by accountants these days.

      I think Steve is doing a great job on his conversion, and I might do the same

      Graeme

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      Post #68957, posted on 01-03-2018 GMT-5 hours    
      Steve, please keep us updated on your progress.

      Gerry

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      Post #68963, posted on 01-04-2018 GMT-5 hours    
      Quote
      Graeme :
      what could be a really big seller like the a B747-400



      90% of their market thinks their 747-400 is totally fine, since it basically looks a bit like a 747-400. Or did you think a big toy manufacturer (because that's what it is!! Look at their website....) like Revell could live off of a crazy bunch of perfectionist modelers like we are?

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      Post #68969, posted on 01-04-2018 GMT-5 hours    
      Quote
      TheFlyingDutchman :
      Quote
      Graeme :
      what could be a really big seller like the a B747-400



      90% of their market thinks their 747-400 is totally fine, since it basically looks a bit like a 747-400. Or did you think a big toy manufacturer (because that's what it is!! Look at their website....) like Revell could live off of a crazy bunch of perfectionist modelers like we are?


      Yeah, that's true, us rivet-counters make up under 5% of their market....

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      Post #68970, posted on 01-04-2018 GMT-5 hours    
      Quote
      usairman737 :
      Steve, please keep us updated on your progress.

      Gerry



      The model is just about complete, ran into two unexpected problem areas. Mating the 744 engines onto the modified 748 wing involves a lot of sanding and fitting. Second is getting a windshield decal to make a proper fit. The decal supplied by DRAW decals was designed to fit the mis-shapen 744 kit and is too wide. I ended up using the AA 3D decal but the fit was not perfect and had to use some heat to get the decal to lay flat. Still not completely satisfied to looked a little too high so I lowered it slightly and now it looks too little too low. Grrrr.

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      Post #68971, posted on 01-04-2018 GMT-5 hours    
      Quote
      Stevej :
      Quote
      usairman737 :
      Steve, please keep us updated on your progress.

      Gerry



      The model is just about complete, ran into two unexpected problem areas. .....Mating the 744 engines onto the modified 748 wing involves a lot of sanding and fitting.....



      To combat that I've been doing the following.... Place some bare metal foil on the wing surface where the engine will go. Take some gap-filling cyanoacrylate glue and squeeze a very small amount near the perimeter of the top of the engine pylon (where it will meet the wing). You wont need much of the CA, just enough to fill any gaps.

      After doing that hold the pylon to the wing for long enough for the CA to cure. If there are still gaps you can add some more CA to them. Once everything dries remove the pylons and sand away the excess CA on the sides of the pylon. If all has gone according to plan there will be no or very little gap remaining between the pylon and the wing.

      I have yet to find a better way to get rid of the gap between engine pylons (or the tail of a DC-10 as I'm currently building), or a wing joint. It allows all the filling and sanding to take place during construction to allow placement afterward. Hope this helps!

      Chris

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      Post #68974, posted on 01-04-2018 GMT-5 hours    
      Just about ready to wrap it up, I'll post the completed model in the "built models"
      , but that will take a few weeks to show up.





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      Post #68979, posted on 01-04-2018 GMT-5 hours    
      Quote
      Graeme :
      I looked at the Dragon kit when first released, although it's not anywhere near as bad as the Nitto/Doyusa/Kepuyuan garbage, going up the list that would be Number 1 worst, followed by Airfix, then Dragon.

      I was stunned when Revell announce a thing like the An225, yet won't redo what could be a really big seller like the a B747-400, obviously making money is not a priority, yet I thought these kit manufacturers were supposed to be run by accountants these days.

      I think Steve is doing a great job on his conversion, and I might do the same



      This is the Dragon model I built a few years ago. Ehhh.

      1528-varig (37).jpg

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      Post #68980, posted on 01-04-2018 GMT-5 hours    
      Steve, that's impressive work on the 747 conversion, and even in its constituent components it looks terrific.

      Regarding the Dragon 747, when I first saw it I thought it would make a nifty learning aid in a classroom or science exhibit, but if you're after a scale model that will trick the eye there are better starting points. The shapes on the Dragon model just looked too much off to my eye and the execution seemed too heavy for workbench purposes.

      Jodie Peeler

      In 1924 Wien was Alaska's first airline. In 1980 it still is.